Women doing full dandavats

Women doing full #dandavats…

 

Whenever I see Vaishnavis at the temple, I never see them full dandavats… rather, they do half ones, which is bowing down on one’s knees with the left side facing the Deities.

And yet, I read this in the Srimad-Bhagavatam:

“When the Supreme Personality of Godhead became visible to Aditi’s eyes, Aditi was so overwhelmed by transcendental bliss that she at once stood up and then fell to the ground like a rod to offer the Lord her respectful obeisances.”

— Srimad-Bhagavatam 8.17.5

The translation is ‘dandavat.’ So in this instance, Aditi fell completely down and did full #dandavats, like a man would.

Not like it’s a truly important detail, but I am just curious about this. 😀

:namaste Namaste!
#1Gaura Priya, Feb 17, 2011
Satsangi
Satsangi
Active Member
Joined:Nov 11, 2009
Messages:897
Ratings:+98
It does translate into dandavat, but there is “ashtanga dandavat”- which men do and also there is “panchang dandavat” (on the knees) which women do.

Regards,
#2Satsangi, Feb 17, 2011
atmarama
atmarama
Struggling Spiritualist
Joined:Nov 2, 2010
Messages:148
Ratings:+10
I have heard that woman can also offer full dandavats, but on their sides…

Haribollo!
#3atmarama, Feb 17, 2011
Gaura Priya
Gaura Priya
IRL
Joined:May 9, 2009
Messages:4,610
Ratings:+317
I know about the sides dandavats… and I wonder, why is it that they can not do dandavats as men do? Is there something against breasts touching the ground?
#4Gaura Priya, Feb 17, 2011
Wannabe Yogi
Wannabe Yogi
Well-Known Member
Joined:Mar 8, 2009
Messages:4,858
Ratings:+556
In the Gita Govinda it was Krishna who got down on the ground and Radha who put her foot on His head.
#5Wannabe Yogi, Feb 17, 2011
Like Like x 1

Wannabe Yogi
Wannabe Yogi
Well-Known Member
Joined:Mar 8, 2009
Messages:4,858
Ratings:+556
The great Vaishnava saint Meera(Mirabai), a Rajput princess, use to lay on the ground before the Lord Krishna. Her brother-in-law, the new Raja of Chittorgarh Hated Meera’s fame and carelessness of feminine modesty due to her high spiritual states. He tried to kill her many times but failed.

After she gave up the world and being a princess for the love of Krishna. She even went so far as asking to engage in a discussion about spiritual matters with Rupa Goswami, a direct disciple of Chaitanya and one of the great saints of Vrindavan at that time. Since he was a great renunciate, refused to meet a woman. Meera replied that the only true man (purusha) in this universe is lord Krishna. He was shown the error of his ways and he was able to have the Darsan of this great saint. She then danced from one village to another village covering almost all of the whole north of India. She then merged into Krishnas murti in Dwarka. She was seen as one of the Lords Gopis. Her songs of love to Krishna are still used all over India today.

Jai Radhe
#6Wannabe Yogi, Feb 17, 2011 Last edited: Feb 17, 2011
Like Like x 1
Gaura Priya
Gaura Priya
IRL
Joined:May 9, 2009
Messages:4,610
Ratings:+317
Wannabe Yogi said: ↑
After she gave up the world and being a princess for the love of Krishna. She even went so far as asking to engage in a discussion about spiritual matters with Rupa Goswami, a direct disciple of Chaitanya and one of the great saints of Vrindavan at that time. Since he was a great renunciate, refused to meet a woman. Meera replied that the only true man (purusha) in this universe is lord Krishna. He was shown the error of his ways and he was able to have the Darsan of this great saint. She then danced from one village to another village covering almost all of the whole north of India. She then merged into Krishnas murti in Dwarka. She was seen as one of the Lords Gopis. Her songs of love to Krishna are still used all over India today.

Jai Radhe
Jai Srimannarayana!

I have heard the other side of Mirabai, lol. It was said that Mirabai was very much full of pride and wanted to replace Radharani’s love with her love, and how Mirabai was competing against Radharani.

Rupa Goswami met up with Mirabai, and offered her diksha into the Gaudiya Vaishnava fold. She refused, saying that only Krishna is the Supreme Male and everyone else is prakrti, female; in essence, she rejected guru-shishya, or at least subtly went against diksha as part of bhakti sadhana.

She is not accepted in the Gaudiya Vaishnava fold because of her competition against Radharani and her disbelief in sampradayic authority. :p

How interesting that so many stories we know in Sanatana Dharma end up having alternative perceptions. 😀

Hare Krishna!
#7Gaura Priya, Feb 17, 2011
Wannabe Yogi
Wannabe Yogi
Well-Known Member
Joined:Mar 8, 2009
Messages:4,858
Ratings:+556
madanbhakta said: ↑
Jai Srimannarayana!

I have heard the other side of Mirabai, lol. It was said that Mirabai was very much full of pride and wanted to replace Radharani’s love with her love, and how Mirabai was competing against Radharani.

Rupa Goswami met up with Mirabai, and offered her diksha into the Gaudiya Vaishnava fold. She refused, saying that only Krishna is the Supreme Male and everyone else is prakrti, female; in essence, she rejected guru-shishya, or at least subtly went against diksha as part of bhakti sadhana.

She is not accepted in the Gaudiya Vaishnava fold because of her competition against Radharani and her disbelief in sampradayic authority. :p

How interesting that so many stories we know in Sanatana Dharma end up having alternative perceptions. 😀

Hare Krishna!
Click to expand…
Sorry this all sounds like sour grapes to me.

She had a Guru, His name was Ravidas so she clearly accepted sampradayic authority its just that she was not a Gaudiya Vaishnava. She wrote songs with his name in it. She is seen as a real historic figure, even the Muslim Ruler Akbar was impressed by her devotion to the Lord Krishna. I don’t think that anybody takes the story you said seriously but the Gaudiya Vaishnava folks. There is just no historical basis for it.

It is very clear that she was a devotee of Vishnu yet she is rejected by some Vaishnava communties and accepted by most Smarta and Tantrics and many Vaishnava groups. I think this says more about the people who reject her then it does about her.
#8Wannabe Yogi, Feb 17, 2011

Gaura Priya
Gaura Priya
IRL
Joined:May 9, 2009
Messages:4,610
Ratings:+317
Wannabe Yogi said: ↑
It is very clear that she was a devotee of Vishnu yet she is rejected by some Vaishnava communties and accepted by most Smarta and Tantrics and many Vaishnava groups. I think this says more about the people who reject her then it does about her.
Oh, I am well aware that she had a guru, but of course that does not brush well with Vaishnavite authority. Sure, many individual Vaishnavites individually accept her and her devotion to Krishna, but the bigger, organisational aspects do not, unfortunately.

I think there is much bias of history with Gaudiya Vaishnavites. It is the same with Vallabhacharya, who was also a great Vaishnava philosopher and brought about Pushtimarg; his lineage is definitely Vaishnava and is accepted by Gaudiya Vaishnavas as legitimate, even though their historical accounts between Vallabhacharya is downgraded towards Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu.

Back to the original intention of the thread, it is good that Mirabai broke this rule about giving dandavats, but do her followers also follow suite with this? I have heard that there are many groups that claim to stem from her lineage, but unfortunately I do not know much about them.
#9Gaura Priya, Feb 18, 2011
Satsangi
Satsangi
Active Member
Joined:Nov 11, 2009
Messages:897
Ratings:+98
madanbhakta said: ↑
Back to the original intention of the thread, it is good that Mirabai broke this rule about giving dandavats, but do her followers also follow suite with this? I have heard that there are many groups that claim to stem from her lineage, but unfortunately I do not know much about them.
For Saints like Meerabai who have realized the God, the common Dharmas do not apply if they break it. In my opinion, such Saints rarely deviate from the Dharma as they are aware that their followers will then for sure deviate totally from the Dharmas.

Regards,
#10Satsangi, Feb 18, 2011 Last edited: Feb 18, 2011
Wannabe Yogi
Wannabe Yogi
Well-Known Member
Joined:Mar 8, 2009
Messages:4,858
Ratings:+556
Satsangi said: ↑
For Saints like Meerabai who have realized the God, the common Dharmas do not apply if they break it. In my opinion, such Saints rarely deviate from the Dharma as they are aware that their followers will then for sure deviate totally from the Dharmas.

Regards,
Since I am not Indian, many of these rules I just don’t get. Is it common in all sects of Hinduism that there are rules about dandavats for women. I think I have seen a group of old women in the Kashi Vishwanath Temple doing a full prostration. Is this uncommon.
#11Wannabe Yogi, Feb 18, 2011
Satsangi
Satsangi
Active Member
Joined:Nov 11, 2009
Messages:897
Ratings:+98
Wannabe Yogi said: ↑
Since I am not Indian, many of these rules I just don’t get. Is it common in all sects of Hinduism that there are rules about dandavats for women. I think I have seen a group of old women in the Kashi Vishwanath Temple doing a full prostration. Is this uncommon.
It is mostly in Vaishnava sects as far as I know that women do “Panchanga” pranam. But, this rule is widely followed by most women to my knowledge as this kind of pranam suits them more, I believe. The rational behind this rule, in my opinion, is that the panchanga pranam appear more dignified to a woman and less “distracting” for nearby men than the full dandavats.

Regards,
#12Satsangi, Feb 18, 2011
Vinayaka
Vinayaka
devotee
Premium Member
Joined:Feb 10, 2011
Messages:34,474
Ratings:+19,837
Religion:Saivite Hindu
Wannabe Yogi said: ↑
Since I am not Indian, many of these rules I just don’t get. Is it common in all sects of Hinduism that there are rules about dandavats for women. I think I have seen a group of old women in the Kashi Vishwanath Temple doing a full prostration. Is this uncommon.
Being Indian may not help at all. Most Bengalis have never been to Tamil Nadu or Gujarat. Most Tamilians have never been to Gujarat of Bengal. Most Gujaratis have never been to TN or Bengal. India is far more like Europe. People assume that just because pujas are performed a certain way in their village, people dress a certain way, etc. then the rest of India is the same. Not so. This has been my experience. Of course there is the odd person who has travelled far and wide in the subcontinent. That’s different.

For example, I read an article of how there are over a hundred ways to drape a sari, each being the ‘Right’ way of course. Besides that, many or perhaps most women in India don’t even wear saris, but suits.

Personally, I’ve never seen a woman do a full prostration, other than one who was rolling around Palani temple as a penance, and that’s another discussion altogether. Many North Indians wouldn’t know who Murugan even is. But I haven’t been around much at all.
#13Vinayaka, Feb 18, 2011
Satsangi
Satsangi
Active Member
Joined:Nov 11, 2009
Messages:897
Ratings:+98
The culture is different in different states in India and so is the language. But, there is a “common thread” in all these diversities.

Most women in India do wear traditional dresses including Saris, only in the cities they wear suits.

Yes, in North India, people would not know “Murugan”, but ask who is KartikSwami (which is His name in the Puranas) and most will know.

Regards,
#14Satsangi, Feb 19, 2011
Gaura Priya
Gaura Priya
IRL
Joined:May 9, 2009
Messages:4,610
Ratings:+317
Satsangi said: ↑
It is mostly in Vaishnava sects as far as I know that women do “Panchanga” pranam. But, this rule is widely followed by most women to my knowledge as this kind of pranam suits them more, I believe. The rational behind this rule, in my opinion, is that the panchanga pranam appear more dignified to a woman and less “distracting” for nearby men than the full dandavats.

Regards,
That is what I was wondering myself in terms of why are the women given a special form of pranam, and I wonder how a woman going fully down like a rod disturbing for men. I just don’t get it.

Especially as a former practicing Vaishnava… It boggles my mind.
#15Gaura Priya, Feb 19, 2011
Andal
Andal
resident hypnotist
Joined:May 13, 2009
Messages:962
Ratings:+197
madanbhakta said: ↑
That is what I was wondering myself in terms of why are the women given a special form of pranam, and I wonder how a woman going fully down like a rod disturbing for men. I just don’t get it.

Especially as a former practicing Vaishnava… It boggles my mind.
Have you guys tried to do full pranam in a sari? Panchanga makes more sense considering what we wear to the mandir. If I did full on dandavats in a sari I would spend the whole pranam worrying about if the top part of the sari will slip off when I get back up or if I’ll trip on a pleat etc. From a logistical point of view it makes sense to do the panchanga. Sure sometimes us ladies wear salwar kamez to the mandir but I’m sure that was not an option back in the day when these traditions started. To me it’s not a huge deal that women do it differently than guys. The emotion and intent are still the same.

What I find more mind boggling is the low status given to women in some Vaishnav circles. That is far more important.

Aum Hari Aum!
#16Andal, Feb 20, 2011 Last edited: Feb 20, 2011
Like Like x 1
Gaura Priya
Gaura Priya
IRL
Joined:May 9, 2009
Messages:4,610
Ratings:+317
krishnakanta said: ↑
Have you guys tried to do full pranam in a sari? Panchanga makes more sense considering what we wear to the mandir. If I did full on dandavats in a sari I would spend the whole pranam worrying about if the top part of the sari will slip off when I get back up or if I’ll trip on a pleat etc. From a logistical point of view it makes sense to do the panchanga. Sure sometimes us ladies wear salwar kamez to the mandir but I’m sure that was not an option back in the day when these traditions started. To me it’s not a huge deal that women do it differently than guys. The emotion and intent are still the same.

What I find more mind boggling is the low status given to women in some Vaishnav circles. That is far more important.

Aum Hari Aum!
Sorry, Mataji. 😮
#17Gaura Priya, Feb 21, 2011
Andal
Andal
resident hypnotist
Joined:May 13, 2009
Messages:962
Ratings:+197
madanbhakta said: ↑
Sorry, Mataji. 😮
No need to be sorry Prabhu 😮 My response was a little tongue in cheek (hope it didn’t come off as harsh as that was not my intent). From a logistical stand point it makes sense. I have no idea what the actual thinking behind the difference is though.

Aum Hari Aum!
#18Andal, Feb 21, 2011
Wannabe Yogi
Wannabe Yogi
Well-Known Member
Joined:Mar 8, 2009
Messages:4,858
Ratings:+556
krishnakanta said: ↑
Have you guys tried to do full pranam in a sari?
This was a great answer.
#19Wannabe Yogi, Feb 21, 2011
Gaura Priya
Gaura Priya
IRL
Joined:May 9, 2009
Messages:4,610
Ratings:+317
krishnakanta said: ↑
No need to be sorry Prabhu 😮 My response was a little tongue in cheek (hope it didn’t come off as harsh as that was not my intent). From a logistical stand point it makes sense. I have no idea what the actual thinking behind the difference is though.

Aum Hari Aum!
I know one of my friends would put 30 pins in her sari, and thus she could probably do a full dandavats and get up alright.

Not only that, but many of the girls do not wear saris, but ‘gopi skirts’ instead, since they are easy to wear when it’s just a choli-lehnga. 😀
#20Gaura Priya, Feb 22, 2011
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Page 1 of 2
12Next >
Loading…

New Threads

Quagmire I’m quitting R2-D2
Quagmire posted 11 minutes ago
Friend of Mara Teacher’s Unions
Friend of Mara posted Today at 2:30 PM
Harel13 I am quitting R4
Harel13 posted Today at 2:00 PM
Mark Dohle “As I experience God’s mercy,…
Mark Dohle posted Today at 1:41 PM
Nakosis Speaking of Florida…
Nakosis posted Today at 1:31 PM
Nakosis I am Quitting California
Nakosis posted Today at 11:27 AM
Geoff-Allen Some interesting book reviews!
Geoff-Allen posted Today at 10:46 AM
Geoff-Allen Saying Yes to Life (Even the…
Geoff-Allen posted Today at 9:51 AM
Sgt. Pepper Let’s guess what’s next in…
Sgt. Pepper posted Today at 9:13 AM
Geoff-Allen The only guide to happiness you…
Geoff-Allen posted Today at 8:40 AM

Home
Forums
Discuss Individual Religions
Dharmic Religions DIR
Hinduism DIR
ReligiousForums.com – UI.X
A Whipp Media Site
Home
Contact Us
Help
Terms and Rules
Privacy Policy
Forum software by XenForo™ © 2010-2018 XenForo Ltd.
Theme designed by Audentio Design.

×
AN ELITE CAFEMEDIA PUBLISHER

Post view 472 times